“Oh, give me land, lots of land, under starry skies above
Don’t fence me in.” — Cole Porter and Robert Fletcher
Listen: Fifth and Brannan has come unstuck in time.
The first thing you notice in the gap between the opaque black fencing and the barbed wire are the oscillating lights atop scores of idle autonomous vehicles.
As if by an occult hand, one ghost car after another is remotely summoned and glides to the exit. It is quickly replaced by a driverless vehicle returning to the Fifth and Brannan streets staging yard after a foray into the outside world.
Surely this is a vision of San Francisco’s future: Boxy Ojais and squat Jaguars — the X-Wings and Y-Wings of the Waymo fleet — silently coasting hither and yon to squire San Franciscans about at the touch of a button. On this day, there may have been 50 of them in the Fifth and Brannan staging area, but there was room for many more.
And yet, this was also a vision of San Francisco’s past and, specifically, SoMa’s past: A vast sea of open lots and, specifically, parking lots.
Viewers watching the stunningly low-quality 1970s Blaxploitation film “Dolemite” laugh and point the first time they see a visible boom microphone in the shot. It becomes less novel when you realize there’ll be a boom microphone in most shots.
Autonomous vehicles are in many or most shots here in San Francisco. That’s why visitors to San Francisco stop and gawk at them, but locals don’t.
For the most part, San Franciscans think critically about autonomous vehicles in terms of how they interact on the road with other vehicles, first responders or, in one unfortunate case, a kitty cat. Less consideration, naturally, is given to what the ghost cars are doing when they’re out of sight, out of mind and not moving around.
But the people in charge of deploying these technological marvels thought a lot about this, and long ago. And it wasn’t high-level technological marvel thinking: It was old-school business and real estate.
Almost a decade ago, Molly Turner, a lecturer at the University of California, Berkeley’s Haas School of Business specializing in urban technology, had her first conversation with a higher-up in the world of autonomous vehicles.
“He told me then that his No. 1 priority was finding real estate to park his vehicles on for charging,” she recalls. “And this was before Waymo was really deployed anywhere. Autonomous vehicle fleets need places to park and charge them.”
But not just to charge them: They also need to be maintained. And cleaned: People do strange and terrible things in autonomous vehicles when there’s no human being to tell you not to — though, rest assured, you are on camera, and your licentiousness is being viewed by someone, somewhere.
Or your slovenliness: Riders may be less than considerate about where they put their trash. Or they may puke.
Regardless, autonomous vehicles need to be serviced and cleaned by autonomous humans before heading back out to service, and that requires the car to not be moving. So: garages or parking lots.
But where autonomous vehicle companies would want to put those garages and parking lots and where the city would ostensibly want them to go aren’t necessarily compatible in the long term.
Mission Local has obtained a list of several dozen sites where AV companies put their cars, have attempted to put their cars, or formerly put their cars. These are, by and large, sited near the people the companies would want to serve — which is, business-wise, a great idea.
But these also tend to be sites where the city may have greater land-use aspirations than garages or parking lots.
“It’s the core,” answers a veteran San Francisco real-estate broker when asked where autonomous vehicle companies want to site their garages and parking lots. “Everyone wants to be in the core. That’s where all the rides are. And, as adoption moves out to the neighborhoods, they’ll go there.”
Nobody ever accused the trillion-dollar companies backing robotaxis of being bad at business — and keep the autonomous vehicles near the people who use autonomous vehicles would seem to be good business theory.
And it’s not just theory, it’s practice: Terrawatt, a company that has made electric-vehicle-fleet charging its raison d’être, has adopted this as a core component of its business model.
“We survey each market to find the strongest overlap of power availability, proper zoning and customer operating needs,” it states on a portion of its site titled “Where rideshare customer demand is highest.”
If you take a glance at the map of where San Francisco’s autonomous vehicle fleet parking sites are, were or aspire to be, patterns emerge. Only one of the 30 sites is west of Gough. And while a handful, including some of the big ones, are in the city’s less populated and less affluent industrial southeast, the lion’s share are in the crowded northeast, where rideshare customer demand is highest.
In the abstract, locating a service near the people who desire that service is not a revelatory concept. But, in the concrete — literally and figuratively — locating parking garages and surface lots in populated areas where housing could be developed did surprise land-use professionals and urban studies experts. And not just in San Francisco.
University of Oregon professors Nico Larco and Robert Binder, two of the authors of a recent study analyzing the potential impact autonomous vehicle expansion may have on parking and development, both said they were initially surprised to see large robotaxi depots in populated, upscale and central Los Angeles neighborhoods.
“What were these sites zoned for? My guess is they weren’t zoned for light industry,” Binder says. “These are not industrial areas. They are locating themselves in an area where there are customers.”
Putting a product within easy reach of customers — and minimizing the time vehicles are driving in from industrial zones in the sticks, empty, and not earning revenue — is pretty intuitive business practice.
But putting parking lots in areas zoned for housing and customer-serving businesses is not intuitive city planning practice. Not anymore at least: Downtown Houston in the 1970s is nobody’s role model for ideal urban land-use and transportation.
But here’s where the long-term wishes of autonomous vehicle companies and the city they’ve made their testing ground ostensibly diverge. San Francisco can’t grow and evolve without building more housing. And autonomous vehicle companies can’t grow and evolve without more parking.

Are autonomous vehicle companies impeding San Francisco housing and development? It’s a question that’s been asked before. The fairest answer is: No, not yet.
There are many reasons that development in this city is slow and difficult. There are many reasons — global, national and local — that development is presently not booming. It would be a stretch to say that, at the moment, autonomous vehicle parking, charging and staging sites are what’s keeping buildings from being built.
But prosperity, they say, is around the corner. And, sooner or later, the numbers will make financial sense for housing and development on sites presently occupied by herds of ghost cars. Many of these sites are already entitled for significant housing and development.
On sites rented on a month-to-month basis in which little infrastructure has been installed, there are fewer impediments to breaking ground for housing when the time is right. But on charging sites — even if the climate becomes ideal to build, build, build — development is less likely to occur.
This is because the upfront investment to install chargers and other infrastructure to service a fleet of electric vehicles is significant.
The Chronicle in 2025 reported that a single supercharging station can cost $400,000. An electrical contractor this month told us that it could run $250,000. That’s before you factor in the cost of additional electrical infrastructure and the electric itself — and fleet-charging sites can have scads of these chargers.
As such, the industry standard for fleet-charging stations is to lock in a long-term, turnkey lease.
“It’s a pain in the ass to get power from PG&E, and it’s a pain in the ass to build this stuff,” says the real-estate broker. “You’re not spending millions of dollars without a long-term lease. You have to amortize that cost.”
And even on robotaxi sites without significant infrastructure, there may be another impediment to future development — guaranteed rent money to the site owner, reliably paid by the richest companies on earth.
“If you could rent out your land to an AV company and you’re getting a six percent return on land value, why would you sell your land?” asks the broker. “You’d have to get a lot more.”
If nothing else, getting into a bidding war with the world’s wealthiest companies would drive up the cost of land even more.

You may ask yourself: But wait! Weren’t autonomous vehicles supposed to do away with the need for parking?
In theory, yes. In practice: Yes and no. Larco, the Oregon professor who studied the interaction between robotaxis and parking, says that one autonomous vehicle cruising around all day could reduce the need for parking by 15 to 18 spots. But here’s the rub: Those are scattered spots, often in outer neighborhoods or towns.
Meanwhile, autonomous vehicles require middling to large concentrated parking and staging sites, which the companies would prefer to see in central, high-traffic areas. Parking spaces, a city planner tells us, “are not going anywhere. They’re just being repurposed.”
And if autonomous vehicles mushroom in San Francisco and a far, far, far higher percentage of trips in this city are undertaken by driverless cars, would scattered parking sites then be converted into housing and development?
Larco, Binder and graduate student Matthew Channing studied exactly that question. And their answer is: There would be less development than you’d expect or hope for.
In Los Angeles, which looks a lot more like Houston in the ’70s than San Francisco, they found that even if robotaxi use exploded, only 3.8 percent of the parcels in L.A. would be more suitable for development.
In San Francisco, they found, the percentage would be even smaller. You need large parking lots to build significant developments and, here, that’s pretty much Stonestown. But, they found, it would still only pencil out to develop a portion of Stonestown’s vast parking lot — say, one-fifth. And that’s if robotaxi use takes off to infinity and beyond.
This is something to think about while watching the futuristic driverless cars arrive and depart from the retrograde full-city-block surface parking lot on Fifth and Brannan.
Perhaps someday cars will fold up into a briefcase, like George Jetson’s. In the meantime, San Francisco’s future and past will continue to duke it out, one parking lot at a time.




The collision will ultimately be with OpenGovSF and the permitting process which takes 20+ pages just to file development entitlement. Yay for progress and efficiency. 🙃
Meanwhile these surveillance parasite robots block human business all over town.
Lurie arrogantly proclaimed this upon us without review! The buck stops there.
Woah, are you telling me that facilities to charge and maintain AVs need physical property, and housing also needs physical property? Mind blown! Of course, the same goes for parking lots, gas stations, car repair garages, supermarkets, restaurants and bars, gyms and stores and all sorts of other retail, schools and playgrounds, and so on. As it has been in cities for hundreds of years. Maybe make this article a series? Right below is an article on prime Mission land slotted for housing for a decade and lenders and builders aren’t that supportive of it. Less housing because of AVs doesn’t crack the top 100 list of concerns.
you can really tell who the people who barely ever ride a bus are.
Q: Are autonomous vehicles and San Francisco development on a collision course?
A: No.
EXAMPLE SOLUTION: The Volkswagen Car Towers at Autostadt in Wolfsburg Germany
https://www.amusingplanet.com/2012/10/volkswagens-car-towers-at-autostadt-in.html
Problem Solved. Next.
No thanks, next transplant moving to Europe…
Looking at the map, most of the active sites are adjacent to the freeway. Those parcels are not what I would consider prime residential development sites.
Even if infill housing is built on most of these sites (and that’s a big if), there is this amazing technology called a parking garage that will allow fleet operators to expand vertically
Greg —
Counterpoint: 1 Rincon is adjacent to the freeway. When you’re on the lower deck of the bridge, you can make out the art prints on the walls of many, many units in many, many high-rises. Long story short: The city, ostensibly, wants more on these sites than staging areas. In the long run, this figures to be an intriguing issue.
Best,
JE
I often see phrases like “EZ freeway access” used to promote home sales, which rather implies that people value short and fast access to 80, 101 and 280. Even if you and I would hate to live next to a freeway.
I’d guess new units are triple-glazed, likes homes close to the airport.
EZ freeway access — i.e., where I live a couple minutes drive from the Chavez-101 on ramps is a selling point. Freeway adjacent — within a couple hundred feet of the freeway is definitely not.
One of the lots in question, on Irwin between 7th and 8th, is adjacent to where I work. My coworkers and I understand that this will be an AV charging lot. And, it is directly adjacent to two recently built apartment buildings–1010 Potrero. I really don’t understand why these lots are permitted by the city without housing built above the car charging facilities. All of this talk of needing to build housing, yet vacant lots in prime locations are slated to just be parking lots. Where are the YIMBYs on this issue?
““What were these sites zoned for? My guess is they weren’t zoned for light industry,” Binder says. “These are not industrial areas. They are locating themselves in an area where there are customers.”
If I recall correctly some of the city’s more prominent NIMBYs lamented the rezoning of light industrial areas like Potrero, SOMA and NorthEast Mission to residential use. They complained about the loss of blue collar jobs, artists’ studios and the construction of expensive lofts and condos that “working people” cannot afford.
Are those same critics now complaining about light industrial use of some of these plots?
Bill —
In a word, no. This is an urban studies professor talking about Los Angeles.
Best,
JE
Bill do you just make things up?
Robot car parking lots are maintenance and storage facilities for a monopolist livery service; calling this “industrial use” cynically perverts the meaning of what industrial use means. Security guards and hosing feces out of Laymos aren’t remotely the kind of job the NEMIZ and other proposals intended to protect.
A fire that melted a freeway changed the use under freeways across the state. If state and local municipal partners develop these sites to lease to these companies and use the revenue for public transit and freeway maintenance it could free up a good deal of buildable space. Two birds!
San Franciscans think critically about autonomous vehicles?? Not always or deeply! I still don’t hear criticism of the fact that they add to CONGESTION on the streets. They are moving around, often empty, when moving on to a customer or lining up on, for instance 14th St., to get into their recharging lot. Watch how many turn from Valencia, Mission and South Van Ness and clog up 14th St. to get to that lot. At intersections where only a few cars can proceed with a green light, there they are–empty and taking up the space of human-driven cars who are driving from point A to point B. Congested intersections = impatient drivers = more speeding = more running red lights to gain an “advantage” = more pedestrian fatalities/injuries. The tech bros have got the lemmings in their hands and ply them with false narratives about how great these robots are and are sooo efficient!
The rubber will hit the road tomorrow when DBI goes all online in a magical holistic (20 + Departments Kumbaya song consolidating disparate software, Poof fixed) Like the orange OpenGov being sold to another powerful orange OpenGov Oompa Loompa . The DBI moment it happens it is destined to fail, as the Beta failed to achieve promised the simple goals of reroofing permits and window permits. Electrical and Plumbing more complex??? Detailed Rubric needed by Director Ms. Watty. FYI the DBI building inspectors never climb up and field inspect the roof. Why get a permit? For numbers of field inspections wasting gas and city car mileage??? Looks good for the numbers OpenGov. The goals to function OpenGov needing another $30,000,000 for this Big Beautiful unbuilt prototype. Show the Departments input involved with some to develop their needs for this transition to prioritize and memorialize legal government documents for future generations. The DBI customers will be left in a in a dark morass when this light switch is flipped. Will past DBI records disappear like in the past. Thanks, H. B for the street cred as you have been there.
Not a word mentioned about real estate devoted to taxicab parking or City provided free car parking along every street. Not to mention the massive amount of garage space in residential building that could be housing units. OK, Waymo is the whipping boy to avert eyes from the Big Elephant in the room.
Larry —
Taxis park in the sticks. Last I checked, trillion-dollar companies don’t own taxi companies and they don’t seek parking garages in the costliest parts of town.
As for the “free car parking along every street,” you seem to be missing the point of this story. Nobody is building housing, let alone lots of housing, in curbside parking.
The notion that a massive explosion of Waymos could lead to additional housing in people’s garages on a scale that would affect city affordability numbers is not as far-fetched as a George Jetson briefcase car, but it’s up there.
Yours,
JE
Sigh….. When one’s only voiced opposition to unregulated robot cars flooding our streets is the land they park on would be better used for market and luxury rate housing, we’re in trouble.
Also come on Joe, Waymos are imperial droids.
So long as autonomous vehicles fail to recognize first responders, fire hoses, all items in their sights (such as people and animals, the streets aren’t safe from autonomous vehicles. The drive for profit is overwhelming the need for safety. The DMV and NTSB should normally weigh in on this, with public safety outweighing the drive for profit. Under current administration(s), who knows? Even a single loss of life is not worth it.
“San Franciscans think critically about autonomous vehicles in terms of how they” take away business from Muni. Adding that one to the list suggests we might see a future where, out of all places. robotaxi services are setting up shop at Muni yards.
Ready or not, it looks like we are fast approaching a point where we’re deciding whether we’re going to keep Muni around, or hand the field over to the Ubers, Lyfts and Waymo of this world.
The more likely scenario is that the Muni buses and trains will themselves become autonomous.
What a ridiculous suggestion to kill MUNI for Waymos?
I really am sad to see people who have moved into San Francisco insisting on changing it into some tech dystopia.
As said, ready or not. Are you ready? Doesn’t look like it. So behold, voters might just go ahead and effectively vote Muni out come the November election. Same goes for BART and Caltrain BTW.
Highly unlikely
The only part of muni worth keeping is the cable cars
I’d also put in a vote for the F line historic streetcars that trundle down Market Street, albeit ponderously. Tourists like those as well.
Otherwise you can probably justify the major arterial bus routes like the 30 and 38. Not so sure about quirky routes like the 35 and 37 that I often see passing by with one passenger. Surely it would be cheaper to give that lonely soul a free Uber ride?
Is it really “ridiculous” to contemplate a future where you summon a robocab rather than wait for a crowded filthy bus? Muni rides cost about $10 a pop, with fares just covering a quarter of that. So Muni is heavily subsidized.
Isn’t it at least possible that it would be more cost effective to give those subsidies to Uber/Lyft or the autonomous car companies? We should at least give the voters that choice.
How much does the road cost per car? We subsidize that 100% We should instead sell it to some private corporation and let them run the city, because that always works out well? Maybe we could have the Flock cameras track walkers on the sidewalks too? Those are subsidized 100%.
This bizarre thought that we need to make all city infrastructure pay for itself comes way way back when there were fights against public transportation itself. At one point we had hundreds of cable cars and mayors convinced everyone that we should rip them all out because cars were going to take over. You can go all through the political history of it and find there are a variety of justifications and influences behind those decisions – and none of them are very palatable.
Bill,
“Muni rides cost about $10 a pop with fares covering. quarter of that.”
Your statement is simply not true and one should not be spreading such misinformation.
Muni’s systemwide average operating cost per ride by mode is $7.03 per boarding– which includes the admittedly very expensive cable car and paratransit costs.
However, the bulk of Muni’s services — buses and light rail cost $3.00 to $4.00 per trip to provide.
Standard motor coaches, trolleybuses, and Muni Metro light rail vehicles represent the most cost-efficient arms of the network due to higher passenger density per service hour.
Adult fares $2.85 (clipper card) / $3.00 (cash) cover ≈ 70% of this cost and ≈ 40% of the systemwide costs.
Accordingly, If you really are serious about reducing overall cost than you’ll want to entirely eliminate paratransit services (≈$52.25/trip) and all of the remarkably labor-intensive cable cars (≈$25.30/trip).
SFMTA’s own reporting gives a farebox recovery rate of about 25% both before and after Covid, down from 35% or so going back a decade or more.
So either way Muni is heavily subsidized and yet still makes a huge loss.
But I’d agree with you that it is the bus routes that are the biggest problem, along with being the easiest to evade fares on. The muni vehicles that run on tracks seem more viable and are less subject to competition from Uber, Waymo etc.
Throwing even more money at Muni to reward its poor performance seems like the triumph of hope over experience.