Exit interview: London Breed says she’ll be remembered as San Francisco’s ‘crisis mayor’

Mission Local is holding exit interviews with elected officials leaving office after the Nov. 5, 2024 election: London Breed, Aaron Peskin, Hillary Ronen, Ahsha Safaí and Dean Preston. You can read our other interviews as they are published here.

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After six and a half years, London Breed is leaving the mayor’s office. She is the first San Francisco mayor to lose a re-election bid since Willie Brown defeated Frank Jordan in 1995. Daniel Lurie will assume office on Jan. 8.

Breed, who turned 50 on the campaign trail, awaited us in her office in Room 200 on the afternoon of Dec. 12. Wedding ceremonies were taking place just outside her door, and curious onlookers hovered near the entrance as Breed staffers within began to pack up. The mayor’s schedule was still full — ours was not the only exit interview — and her desk was topped with papers alongside her gold “What would Beyoncé do?” nameplate.

Breed, sitting behind her desk in a red dress suit, offered Mission Local some chocolates. She then recounted the highs and lows of her tenure in a 40-minute sit-down: How she feels she will be remembered as a “crisis mayor,” her pride in putting housing “at the top of the agenda,” the role of money in politics, and how clean streets partly require a culture shift. “Even in the projects, we cleaned up after ourselves.”

What comes next? She’s not sure, but she will stay in San Francisco, she said, and be back at work soon.

“Black people don’t go on vacation until they got a job.”

This interview has been lightly edited for clarity. 

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Mission Local: Looking back on the campaign, what do you think happened, and what led to this loss?

London Breed: I would just say I’m not going to dwell on what happened. I mean, it’s over. And ultimately, I think it’s important that, you know, elections, they have consequences. You know, people are elected, and then you respect the process and respect the will of the voters, and you move on. I just really appreciate the fact that I was given an opportunity to lead San Francisco in the first place. So I think it’s important to really focus on just the positive. There’s never been anyone like me as mayor of San Francisco. And the fact that something like this wasn’t completely possible and became real sends a strong message, I think, to so many young people, especially growing up in San Francisco, knowing that anything is possible. 

[During the campaign and much of her entire political career, Breed often spoke of her upbringing — a child of the Western Addition projects who grew up surrounded by poverty and gun violence — and used it to emphasize her journey into politics: ‘I come from nothing, and when I say nothing, I come from nothing,’ she said just before Election Day.]

So I just feel really honored and privileged to have been given the opportunity to serve in the first place. And that’s something that I will walk away with, not necessarily the negativity of the campaign. I mean, look, a lot of money was out there. I come from nothing. And I’ve always had to work for what I’ve gotten. And I worked hard for the people of San Francisco. I brought everything I had to the table, and I’m going to always look back on this experience and be really grateful that I’ve had it.

ML: Okay, so looking back on those —

LB: You want to take the pictures, or what are you thinking?

[Here, Breed interjects to invite our photographer to start taking pictures, and offers our reporters some See’s chocolates.]

ML: Yeah, whenever you’re ready.

LB: You want some candy?

ML: Sure.

LB: I know you do.

ML: What’s the best thing here?

LB: I ate the best ones. So you just have to, you know, take your pick.

ML: I’ll take this colorful one.

LB: If it’s not that good, you can always, you know —

ML: See’s is always pretty good.

LB: I usually keep a box of See’s on my desk, because people send me See’s candy all the time.

[We move to the couch, and start the interview again.]

ML: Looking back over these last six and a half years, what are some of your biggest accomplishments?

LB: I think the things that I’m proudest of are just, you know, how I helped lead this city, crisis after crisis after crisis, during some of our most challenging times. Like, when Ed Lee died, it was really devastating for so many people. And people were, ‘Well, what do we do?’ You know, the first thing is, ‘What do we do now,’ right? Our leader is not here. And I stepped in and helped to lead the city. And, during the pandemic, hard decisions had to be made. And I made those hard decisions. And during the rise of anti-Asian hate, during the tragic death of George Floyd, with the uprising around race in this country, we experienced some real battles, and even as we are focusing on our economic recovery. I’ve had to turn us from a pre-pandemic city that didn’t have to work for it, and one notorious for saying no, to a city of yes for any opportunity, making this year one of the most exciting and most fun cities that it’s been in a really long time. 

[Breed, again during the campaign, often emphasized her Covid-era bona fides. Though San Francisco and the other Bay Area counties locked down early, and, on average, suffered less than other cities, Latinx residents in San Francisco actually did worse than those in heavier-hit cities, and experts criticized the city’s slow movement on testing Latinx residents. By late 2020, however, Breed allocated millions to the strategy of neighborhood hubs.]

So I just think that my legacy, of course, is going to be, you know, just probably one as a crisis mayor, as someone who’s led us through challenge after challenge and, more importantly, now in a position where housing is at the top of the agenda, even so much so that during the presidential race, you had that as a topic of conversation.

And I think that with everything we’ve done to change laws, that what I have helped to build in this city with one of the lowest crime rates we’ve seen in over 11 years, lowest homicide rates since the 1960s, over 20,000 people who have exited homelessness, the work we did around fentanyl to see overdose deaths decline, and the increase in the number of people seeking treatment. I can go on and on in unprecedented investments in organizations that have helped us achieve a lot of these goals. 

[Breed made these points repeatedly during the campaign, too.]

I’m really proud that we have the city on a much better footing than we’ve ever had, and I’m leaving it in a better state, even though it’s been a very challenging time and so much was working against us. Nevertheless, we’ve had to find creative ways to work around it. Despite all of that, and despite a very challenging Board of Supervisors, I still have been able to make significant progress that I’m very proud of.

ML: Any regrets from that time? Big regrets?

LB: I think one of the, the — it couldn’t have been predicted, but we were in a pandemic and we needed to make hard decisions around cuts, and one of the cuts was our Office of Neighborhood Services. 

[The Mayor’s Office of Neighborhood Services, until it shut down in early 2020, for years served as a one-stop shop for residents to be connected directly to the mayor’s office for constituent concerns.]

And I think having that direct connection to the community, taking for granted that the Board dealt with community issues and my job as a whole was to run the city, I think that was part of the challenge. And, you know, it would have probably been more helpful to be more engaged in very direct community issues. Because even though I was, people didn’t attribute a lot of what happened in communities to the mayor. You know, I went out there during the campaign season and I talked about all I’ve done, and someone [else] tried to take credit on numerous occasions. People said, ‘Oh, if it wasn’t for —’ I’m like, ‘let me just be very clear. That was not only my legislation, that was money I allocated directly in my budget to help implement that.’ ‘Oh, I didn’t know.’ There was a lot of ‘Oh, I didn’t know. I didn’t know.’ 

[When debating rivals during the campaign, Breed said the same, once lashing out at Daniel Lurie for pointing to an affordable housing project his nonprofit helped build with city funds and approvals.]

The fact that a certain business was open and able to do multiple uses other than one, that was my legislation. The fact that fees were waived for businesses through our first-year-free program, and what we’ve been able to do with over-the-counter for small businesses, that was my work. And so people, I think that, you know, instead of taking credit for a lot of the stuff, I just did the work and I had my team implement it. And sometimes, I think until I started to campaign, people didn’t realize that what they were able to accomplish had a lot to do with what I did as mayor, to remove the barriers, to make it possible without all the obstruction.

ML: What have you found to be the biggest misconception about what the mayor does and what your powers are? What was a lesson about people’s view of this office?

LB: I don’t know if it was a lesson. I just think that, you know, people coming out of the pandemic, people just had a different perspective about how I think they thought government worked. And it allowed people to get more actively engaged, to have a better understanding of how it truly works. And I’ll just use, you know, the police department as an example. And I’m not saying that I was trying to fire anyone or anything like that. I don’t have to, because any of the people that work for me, if I ask them to leave, they would leave. I think that the challenge comes from what happens after they leave, and that I don’t get to directly pick a person to take over that responsibility. And in the case of the police department, there’s a commission. Some are appointed by the board, some are appointed by me. It’s been very complicated and very problematic. So when folks are calling for the firing of somebody, then what? And who are the people making the decision? They’re not elected by the people of San Francisco, we are. I get held accountable for it, but then they get to make decisions that I don’t necessarily agree with. 

[In all likelihood, a reference to Max Carter-Oberstone, a Breed-appointed police commissioner who bucked her wishes and ended Breed’s de facto control of the commission. Regardless, the mayor retains the ability to unilaterally fire the chief of police.]

I think that’s part of the hardest part and a bit of the, I think, misconception about what a mayor is able to do. And those are the kinds of things I’m hoping will change because, you know, and people said, ‘Oh, you did such a great job during the pandemic, why can’t you, you know, do things like that on a normal basis?’ It’s like, well, during the pandemic, I had an emergency declaration and I could move. There was still accountability and transparency, but I didn’t have to go through, you know, the obstacles that are lined up in a bureaucracy that make it difficult to move forward more aggressively. And so instead of taking six months to hire — I mean, instead of taking, you know, a year and sometimes two years to hire a person, which is insane, we were able to do it within a three-month time period. Three months should be normal. Not because of an emergency declaration. And here comes a lot of the misperceptions about that. There’s labor unions, there’s civil-servant stuff. There’s all these different layers that exist in the city when you’re hiring someone. 

And as much as you want to do the direct hire, the direct hires are the people who mostly work directly for you and your office. And, more importantly, in a city like San Francisco, it’s still a small team of people and not a lot of managerial help.

[Breed is speaking directly of staff in the mayor’s office, not the many employees in the city’s departments.]

When you are mayor, you should be able to have a number of different managers, and you need to be able to have a sufficient staff to execute on policy, budget, community. And I see that, you know, the incoming administration is, you know, using, you know, the things that I wanted to do here. 

But then you have to also make the money you have within that department pencil out in terms of your salaries. So it’s a balancing act of, you need these positions, but you have this much money. So if you want to be top-heavy, you can, but then you don’t have the people to execute. You have to work within your means. So I chose to do it in a way where I kind of have the senior people. But I had a lot of people who were executing and doing a lot of the work. It was tough.

ML: Do you mean specifically the policy chiefs proposal that Lurie put forward?

[Lurie, earlier in December, added four “policy chiefs” to the mayor’s office who will oversee different city departments, a shakeup meant to streamline decision-making.]

LB: Yeah, that came out of some of the work that I’ve done and also some of the work that SPUR has done, and we — everyone knows it should be, and there’s been a desire to fix it from a lot of different people. But it does require, you know, if you want senior level staff people that you can attract, there’s money that you have to be able to pay them. Someone coming out of retirement, they’re collecting a retirement check, but now they get to collect the city salary. That’s probably more worth it for someone, versus someone who comes here as an executive and only is collecting a city salary when they are coming out of the private sector, where they were able to make more money. So, it’s complicated, you know.

[A ballot measure passed by voters in 1991 limits mayoral staff salaries to 70 percent of the mayor’s take-home, about $255,000 given Breed’s 2023 salary of $364,582. Dozens of other city employees are paid mid six-figure salaries, some of them top-level administrators, many of them police officers working overtime.]

ML: If you really could do one thing to make your last six years easier, in terms of what the mayor’s office can do, is there a change that comes to mind?

LB: I think that the mayor should be able to hire and fire directly any department head. Period. I mean, I think I think that should happen. And I also think that the mayor’s office should have a much more robust staff. We go back to Willie Brown days. I think he had, like, 200 people working for him. I have like 40, you know. Other mayors had way more people than I’ve had. So I’ve had a very, very small team of direct reports. 

ML: Besides crime being an issue in the election, generally, a lot of people are concerned about street conditions. How much, in your time, did you find that was actually the role of the mayor, versus the supervisors, versus the Department of Public Works?

LB: Well, Department of Public Works is under the city administrator. And again, it goes back to: Yet the mayor is held accountable no matter what. And I think the street conditions, when you look at most neighborhoods in San Francisco, they’re clean. But we still, of course, have challenges with South of Market, the Tenderloin and the Mission. Those are the places. I mean, even the Bayview has improved significantly. But we have those three areas where it is the biggest, biggest problem. And one of the things is, it’s a city agency. But then there’s also behavior. I walked down Mission Street, I remember, for something I was going to. I caught the 22, got off, was walking behind people. All the people — like, not just one or two people — but I’m walking behind people and just looking around, looking at the stores, and people are just throwing stuff on the ground as they’re walking. As if this is just a, you know — as though this community doesn’t deserve more respect.

And, you know, I think part of it is behavior. And these were not people who suffered from addiction like they weren’t homeless. They were just average, everyday, neighborhood people. And so, I think we have to not only make sure that our departments are doing their job, and the organizations we work with to clean up various corridors are doing their job. We have to focus on a cultural shift around cleanliness of our city. We have to hold communities accountable for taking care of the community. And I remember when I ran the African American Art and Culture Complex, it was the cleanest place you ever want to walk in. And those kids and everyone that came there, they knew. And you know what? They learned it there. And they’ve lived it, like, they are not those kinds of young people anymore. They’re adults now, but they are not the kind of young person that would ever think that it’s okay. Because I remember, we were in the Fillmore Mini Park, and we were doing the toy giveaway and people were just, you know, eating their whatever and then taking it to the trash naturally. So I think we have to — it’s more of a cultural shift. It’s a department, yes, but the departments are out there cleaning up. They’re out there power washing. Because you think if they weren’t, it wouldn’t be like, go out there to the Tenderloin early in the morning when their first shift happens, and go see what the Tenderloin is in the morning, and then what it becomes by 10 a.m.

So the city and our city employees, they’re out there working their butts off, and they’re basically, you know, janitors for the public, the side of the public that just shows so much disrespect to community, you know? And that’s why it was so important to get people off the streets. Van Ness [Avenue] is clean, a lot cleaner than it’s ever been, because we got all those tents and those people off the streets of San Francisco. So ultimately, the mayor is going to be held accountable, no matter what. And it’s within a structure. But as someone who understands the city and understands that structure, I know how to push things to get them done. And you know, we have, of course, more work to do. And I think technology might be helpful in helping us to do that when we start putting up more surveillance and all of the stuff that we need in order to help, you know, tune in on areas, go back to areas. I mean, I went to DMACC on Market Street [the Drug Market Agency Coordination Center] the other day, yesterday, I think, and they had just power-washed the whole block. And, you know, someone let their dog take a poop. Right on top of the water. The fresh water that just cleaned the block. And I didn’t see it happen, but I asked the guy, I said, ‘Did they just — ’ at the Lighthouse for the Blind. I said, ‘Did they just clean this area?’ He said, ‘Yep.’ And this dude just came right on by. And I was just like, ‘You know, like, not in the middle of the damn block.’ At least do it out of the way so that nobody steps on it. So anyway, that’s the thing that had bothered me the most, because even in the projects, we cleaned up after ourselves.

ML: How do you fix something like that?

LB: It’s a cultural fix. And I think one of the things that we did a lot before the pandemic, and I think we need to start bringing it back: Regular community cleanups, and bringing people out of where they live to help beautify and clean the neighborhood. People take more ownership, like there are trees that neighborhood kids planted who are grown-ups now. They’re like, ‘I planted that tree. This is my community.’ It’s working to help people build, you know, a feeling of support and hope for a community. And there’s also an element in light of what’s happened with fentanyl, of people who are coming here, and they don’t have the same feeling. They’re coming here for a particular purpose, whether it’s to use or sell drugs. And we’re trying to make that a lot harder. But they don’t have the same kind of feeling. They don’t have the same kind of pride. And so it’s something that I know we have to work on. And the community has to, of course, take ownership of that and make sure that we teach people how to treat our communities.

ML: Looking forward a bit, are there things that you’re most worried about for San Francisco?

LB: I think Trump is definitely — in our immigrant community, like, I was mayor under the [first] Trump administration, where there was a lot of fear. We had to develop a hotline for people to call. They were afraid of people coming into schools, taking their kids, their housing, their workplace. I mean, this is a country that’s built on the backs of immigrants. It just is. And to have people live in fear like that, it was a very hard and sad time. And it’s one of the reasons why we made so many investments in a number of community-based organizations to provide legal service, to provide a hotline, to provide what we could to educate and prepare the community so that they’re ready when things happen and they know what to do. I remember when we had a lot of undocumented minors who were at the border in cages, and there were a number of them who came into San Francisco and we provided legal assistance. I mean, these are kids who are under 18 with no family or nobody here. So what do we do? We got to do something. Well, we’re just going to let them be on their own. So, it just, you know, [sigh] that’s the thing that’s going to be hard. 

[Veteran politicos have all said that the Trump administration’s likely targeting of San Francisco along with the city’s looming $900 million budget deficit are going to be a buzzsaw for Lurie and the new Board of Supervisors.]

And that’s the thing that I hope as mayor; you can’t just worry about San Francisco, because everything is going to hit San Francisco harder, probably, than most places. And part of worrying about what happens with the state and the federal government is worrying about San Francisco. You know, if we lose our $4 billion grant for the high-speed rail, that’s going to be detrimental. And I remember coming into office when there were threats to take away our Caltrain electrification grant, and I was like, nuh-uh, boo boo. I don’t think so, because your red states that voted you in, that’s money lost for them, too. So what do you want to do about that? So, those senators and Congresspeople said, ‘Hey, hold on, Mr. President. This is what it’s going to cost us. I don’t want you messing with it.’ So, it’s like you’re not just hurting San Francisco. You’re hurting, you know — because he does mostly care about the people who helped him get there — so it’s not just hurting San Francisco. You’re hurting jobs and money that goes into the pockets of the people that you’re trying to continue to make rich. And we lose. So that’s why we keep our money. 

You know, you got to fight these battles, and you got to be able to make hard decisions. And so I worry about that. And in light of the budget deficit, there’s going to be some hard decisions. I mean, people don’t like money being taken away. You know, I hope you know, we’re not — it’s one thing to take away positions that are not filled. It’s another thing to furlough or take away positions that are. And that’s why you have to go into the weeds of, as nice as it is to have movie night in the park. That’s a nice-to-have. That’s not a need-to-have, that’s a nice-to-have. And they can raise money in the private sector for that. You know, so making some hard decisions around those kinds of things is going to be important.

ML: On money and politics, there’s a lot of different groups in this city, some support you, some don’t. Do you worry, generally, about money in politics and the influence of money in politics?

LB: Money’s always going to be a part of politics. It’s kind of unfortunate how people with a lot of money in this city, who don’t get their way, decide that they’re going to figure out a way to get their way.

ML: How did you see that during your term?

LB: I saw that in organizations like Neighbors, like TogetherSF. 

[Neighbors for a Better San Francisco and TogetherSF are two of the wealthiest groups active in San Francisco politics, both of which favored Mark Farrell, Breed’s campaign rival, in the mayoral race.]

Having people oppose you is one thing, but having people who are wealthy and expect you to do what they tell you to do, or their bidding, is quite something different. 

[The San Francisco Standard reported in November that Bill Oberndorf and Michael Moritz, respectively the billionaire patrons of Neighbors and TogetherSF, soured on Breed after she differed from them on how to reform the city’s charter.]

And the thing that I am most proud of is, you know, I got here, you know, people, people have said I have all these relationships with all these gazillionaires and the billionaires. But here’s the thing. The 100-aires are my friends too. And I have treated, no matter how much money you have or don’t have, I’m really proud that I have treated everyone kind of the same, meaning, you can have a dollar in your pocket and you’re still going to get love and respect from me based on the type of person that you are, and you’re still going to have a seat at the table to voice your opinion and your concern. I don’t care if you have money or not. And that is what I’m proud of. And bringing people together, bringing people to the table who never would have been able to serve on a commission, who never would have had access to the mayor of San Francisco. The fact that I can walk into the Tenderloin now, and get more love than any other neighborhood I walk through in San Francisco, because of how I treat people. 

And, you know, I think that, you know, what I’ve experienced sometimes with people with money is that they are probably used to getting their way all the time. And for me, it’s — I will work with anybody who’s working with me, whether they have it or not. And my hope is that it’s more about the city than it is about your personal agenda or your ego. And for those who were more about the city, in many instances they stuck with me. And I think that, you know, money in politics is an unfortunate thing, but it’s a thing, and I don’t think it’s going away. I do think that, or I do hope that, ultimately, San Francisco doesn’t suffer as a result of it. You know, and I think, I think that the city’s in a really, really good place right now, even though there’s issues and things that need to be dealt with. I mean, it’s a major city. Major cities have problems. They don’t just go away! But in 2017, there were 30,000 car break-ins. There were less than 10,000 car break-ins this year. And just you don’t see glass like you used to. And when people say, ‘Well, people aren’t reporting it.’ Okay. But technology, the way it is, it was harder to report in 2017 than it is today. So I don’t want to hear that. It’s still going down. And I’m not saying it’s going away, but it’s changed. We got a new DA. We got technology, surveillance, license-plate readers, drones. 

[In March, voters passed Breed’s police surveillance and car chase measure, Proposition E, which expanded the department’s ability to use drones and other technologies. Since then, SFPD has purchased and used six drones, and plans to buy 22 more.]

We have all this stuff I couldn’t I didn’t have before. I had to build it and had to give it time to work. And it’s working. And so, when you look, when I look at the data every week, all I see is down arrows: Property crimes, robberies in general, everything is trending down. But I have never said it’s going to completely go away. It’s never going to go away. But the difference is how we respond. The country’s national average for homicide clearance rate, meaning solve rate. It’s like 50 percent. And you know what it is in San Francisco? 

ML: Like 88, is that right?

LB: Yes it is. [grinning] I was going to say almost 90. Eighty-eight.

ML: I saw the press release.

LB: But you see my point?

ML: Absolutely.

LB: The difference is how we respond, how we hold people accountable, how we make it clear to folks that this is not the place. Biggest drop in retail theft of any major city in the country. So what we have done and what we have built is something that I’m very proud of, and looking forward to seeing it only get better, because this office, mayors will come and go, Board of Supervisors will come and go. This office is bigger than a person. It’s about the work we need to do to keep San Francisco moving forward in a positive direction. And I know that there are a lot of things that I’ve done. And yes, the next administration will be taking credit for all my stuff. And I get it, you know, and even when I came on board, you know, I acknowledged Ed Lee initially in the beginning, because he was responsible for some things. And then, eventually, the stuff started to be things that I did. And in fact, a lot of it with Ed was like, 730 Stanyan. Ed Lee helped me buy that property. He worked with me on that when I asked, and I delivered that. But he helped when he was mayor, and I delivered that project. So I appreciate what role he played in helping to do that, and will always acknowledge him and be grateful for that. And so my hope is that people remember that, at least. You know, I won’t be able to be around, uh, to, to remind people. But my hope is that there’ll be people around to at least understand that I have left the city in a much better place, despite all the crises that we’ve had to endure.

ML: Finally, what’s next for you?

LB: Everybody wants to know what’s next. Well, sadly, as mayor of San Francisco, I can’t engage in any conversations with anybody. But, you know, I’m not wealthy, so, you know, like, I’m gonna have to get a job eventually. And also, I’ve never known anything other than public service and working hard. Ever since I was 10 years old, I scraped, and so I am not the kind of person who can sit around and not do anything. And I am hopeful that something will come my way. I’m a very cause-driven person, and I’m hoping to be able to continue to do a lot of the things I care about. I care about community. I was in the Mission today. Carnaval’s new space. I made that happen, and I’m so proud they are going to be protected. It is one of the most incredible things to look around this city and to think about how I’ve touched, whether it’s housing, community, space, activation, buildings, all of that. It’s the work that I enjoy the most. How you were able to have a positive impact on people’s lives and change the course of the future because of the security that you create by supporting an organization that’s not only important to the community, it’s important to our city and our economy. And it’s an economic driver for San Francisco and those small businesses, especially during that time. So I can go on and on about a number of examples and stuff. But I am just really proud. I’m proud of what I’ve done. I’m proud of how I built and built things from scratch and tore down bureaucracy in order to get us to a place where we are finally here after being through so much. And it’s not easy to do that. It’s not easy. But here we are, and I hope that the work continues.

ML: Do you think you’ll stay in San Francisco?

LB: Where else would I go? Like, where else would I go?

ML: Might your next job involve Bloomberg?

[Michael Bloomberg is a long-time Breed ally, whom she endorsed for president in 2020. In 2024, he gave $1.5 million towards her re-election campaign. Breed, in a final act, appointed Stephen Sherrill to Assemblywoman Catherine Stefani’s vacant District 2 supervisor seat. Sherrill is a Bloomberg protégé and a former staffer in Bloomberg’s New York City mayoral administration — and virtually unknown in District 2.]

LB: I want to be very clear. I don’t know what I’m going to do. Okay. That’s part of the problem. I don’t know what I’m going to do, and I can’t engage in any conversations to, like, if someone offered me a job tomorrow. I can’t even have that discussion. Right. Right. People have already reached out. Mayor. What’s next? Can I help you? I said I will call you after Jan. 8. For any, any opportunities. Who knows? I might end up being your boss. [laughs] 

But I’m very talented, and I work very hard, and I know a lot of things, so I’m sure there’ll be some great opportunities out there for me. I just don’t know what it is because I haven’t really thought about it. I’ve been — you got to understand, I’ve done community, and government, and community work my whole life. This is all I’ve ever done. This is all I’ve ever known. And this is — I did this because it’s what I care about. And so, now I have to think about, because when you start going out there into other arenas, people may want you to focus on one particular thing. And the question is, do I want to focus on one thing? I don’t know. So I need time to separate and to figure that out. But it will not be long before I’m at least, you know, employed somewhere. You know, like, folks are like, ‘You’re going on vacation?’ I said, ‘Black people don’t go on vacation until they got a job.’ I don’t know how this new generation, they’re like, they get fired and they go on vacation. I’m like, no, that’s not me. I’m old school.  

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